Is downloading tv series/films acceptable?

[ikat381]

Originally Posted by Smokey

Point 1. Just because an artist can earn money through touring doesn't mean you can steal their music...Point 3. In even more cases it has decreased sales. There's not even the lure of getting the real thing for increased quality so the "free trial argument" falls down a bit there.

The heaviest downloaders are also the biggest music customers:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...l-1812776.html
http://www.michaelgeist.ca/content/view/2347/125/

Also, copyright violation is not the same as stealing. You might argue that it's just as bad as stealing (and I would disagree), but I don't think it's accurate to say that someone "steals" music when they download a song.

[Smokey]

You take the goods of another without permission. That's stealing. Especially considering you can buy legal downloads which takes convenience out of the equation. On Amazon you can download a song with a single click.

And if the heaviest illegal downloaders spend more on music then just think how much more they should be spending. It just means they are stealing more. Plus in my experience the illegal downloaders I've known have downloaded around 10 times what they purchased at least.

[maxxy_p]

Originally Posted by Smokey

You take the goods of another without permission. That's stealing. Especially considering you can buy legal downloads which takes convenience out of the equation. On Amazon you can download a song with a single click.

I don't think this argument helps the anti-downloading cause. It's not the same. By stealing someone's wallet or passport I am directly and deliberately depriving them of what is theirs and lowering their quality of life. No matter how you spin it, that's not what happens when you download. Maybe you shouldn't do it, maybe morally you owe them something, but you are not stealing from them.

Originally Posted by ikat381

There’s a few reasons why I don’t think it’s completely contradictory to let people download things freely:

1) There’s other ways to make money with your art besides selling copies of it.
2) We know that free downloading has not stopped people from successfully selling copies.
3) We know that in many cases, free downloading has actually increased the sale of copies.

I think these are pretty poor arguments as well, from the other side. They are enabling arguments, excuses for "oh I can do this because maybe they'll still make money", rather than legitimate reasons why you have the right to download their stuff.

[ikat381]

Originally Posted by maxxy_p

I think these are pretty poor arguments as well, from the other side. They are enabling arguments, excuses for "oh I can do this because maybe they'll still make money", rather than legitimate reasons why you have the right to download their stuff.

When a law is restricting your activities in a democratic country, it's up to the ones in power to prove that the law is justified, otherwise it should be scrapped.

We shouldn't have to ask ourselves "What is our legitimate reason for being able to download freely?" We should be asking lawmakers "What is the artists' legitimate reason for prohibiting people from downloading freely?"

[Smokey]

Without trying to start a debate on the definition of stealing, lets say you are a photographer. If I bought a picture, copied it and gave it to a hundred other people then they wouldn't buy the original from you. This doesn't directly affect you but in real terms you have lost a hundred potential customers. You may not like defining it as stealing but the effects are similar and it is in no way morally justifiable.

Originally Posted by ikat381

We shouldn't have to ask ourselves "What is our legitimate reason for being able to download freely?" We should be asking lawmakers "What is the artists' legitimate reason for prohibiting people from downloading freely?"

Because they work hard to make a product which they don't get their due proceeds from. This discourages them to make said product. That is why it is illegal and immoral.